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October 6th, 2013 | #4861 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 1,054
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October 7th, 2013 | #4862 |
Junior Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Heraclion, Hellenic Republic
Posts: 13
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Many thanks to all for the warm welcome!
Btw I have great news. These are the results of the latest internet poll. The question was "Which party would you vote for if there were elections next Sunday?" 43,564 people took part Here are the results. Obviously the lies of the media failed to sway the public opinion and strengthened the G.D. greatly! Now we are second. Only SYRIZA remains to be defeated. Hopefully soon. Long live Hellas and the Golden Dawn! |
October 7th, 2013 | #4863 |
Junior Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Heraclion, Hellenic Republic
Posts: 13
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Welcome to the forum EllasHoplite!
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ΖΗΤΩ Η ΕΛΛΑΣ! ΖΗΤΩ ΤΟ ΕΘΝΟΣ! ΖΗΤΩ Η ΧΡΥΣΗ ΑΥΓΗ!
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October 7th, 2013 | #4864 | |
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In the US, the Leo Frank trial was the opening bell, as they coordinated a national newspaper campaign to try to get Frank freed, or at least not executed. Back then, far more papers were independent, so their campaign didn't work. But it showed them what was possible with time and greater control. This was around 1915. |
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October 7th, 2013 | #4865 |
Junior Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 149
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Heil from another Greek. Also invited by Ahnenerbe.
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October 7th, 2013 | #4866 | |
Moderator
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Jew S. A.
Posts: 3,679
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October 7th, 2013 | #4867 | |
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October 7th, 2013 | #4868 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Missouri
Posts: 12,684
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Hail Golden Dawn, indeed !!!
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“To learn who rules over you simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize” —–Voltaire |
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October 7th, 2013 | #4869 |
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Welcome to VNN... To you and the other new people over the weekend. You're all in as registered users, from what I can see.
Anything you can tell us first hand about what's actually going on inside Greece is appreciated. Anyway, glad you guys are here! |
October 7th, 2013 | #4870 | |
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What's different from roughly 1900 on is the rise of mass media. Not just newspapers, radio and tv and such, but the national brands and campaigns these made possible. Jews have always lied and practiced to deceive and undermine, but they didn't always have the technical tools to let them easily do this on a national or global scale. Today, they do. The best figure for seeing the sort of sea change in possibilities was Eduard Bernays, the relative of Freud, who styled himself the 'Father of Public Relations, and who set up some of the first commercial campaigns proving you could mass influence the nation with the new media. He got US women to smoke cigarettes, and he popularized diamond engagement rings - for two commercial, non-political examples. He and fellow jew Bernard Baruch were instrumental in demonstrating to other jews that they could fairly easily and successfully mass-manipulate a giant nation into supporting whatever they wanted to do, socialize the economy or change private behavior. And then in the 1913-1915 frame you had the beginnings of a rise, as I hinted, at a national newspaper network, if informal, whereby editors in agreement could push a particular cause and agenda, such as the liberation of jewish pedophile/murderer Leo Frank. Last edited by Alex Linder; October 7th, 2013 at 12:55 PM. |
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October 7th, 2013 | #4871 | |
Banned
Join Date: May 2013
Location: a LAND that never been occupied
Posts: 1,933
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SORRY did not understand what you ask. Soros key agent PAYMASTERS. 125. Traitors of our motherland. 525 Heads of organizations and families who actively participate in destroy my MOTHERLAND. 350 Media? We dont care much for the media whores, who in all reality are just megaphones that make more damage to the ones who pay them to brainwash the people. When the heads ( PAYMASTERS) are gone, the minions will wither and die with out any of us to dirty his hands on shit. No we are speaking for the major policy players against us. Last edited by HardHawk; October 7th, 2013 at 02:31 PM. |
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October 7th, 2013 | #4872 |
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[controlled media - world socialist web site back with more analysis. normally they write about greece/gd every 2-3 months, but this is their second article in days. altho these are overt commies writing these articles, i find they consistently bring out facts and analytical insights that are more sophisticated in what you get in the controlled media's popular press articles. the stuff bolded below offers examples of what i mean - you get more connections and depth with WSWS than in the more superficial controlled media]
Manoeuvres between Greece’s major parties accompany clampdown on Golden Dawn By Robert Stevens 7 October 2013 The crackdown on the fascist Golden Dawn party by the New Democracy/PASOK government has been the occasion behind which a major realignment of Greek politics is taking place. Following the September 18 murder of 34-year-old Pavlos Fyssas, an antifascist hip-hop musician, by a supporter of the fascist Golden Dawn, the government moved rapidly to arrest the top echelons of the party including its longtime leader Nikolaos Michaloliakos and four of its other MPs. More than 20 of its members have also been arrested. The decision of the government of Prime Minister Antonis Samaras to move against Golden Dawn was not taken on the spur of the moment, but animated by strategic considerations and based upon a preexisting plan. Before the clampdown, the Samaras regime faced an upsurge of working-class struggles. From September 16, the number of strikes against austerity escalated, with teachers mounting a five-day strike, hospital doctors staging a three-day strike, and a two-day national general strike beginning September 18. University students and staff also protested, as nine universities were forced shut by massive cuts to administrative staff. Fyssas’s murder in the midst of these events had a catalytic impact, sparking off antifascist protests involving tens of thousands nationally, with pitched battles with the police. Amid growing popular anger at the acute social crisis, Fyssas’s murder galvanised masses angry not only at the fascists, but also at the Greek state’s naked collusion with them. Though it had previously turned a blind eye to hundreds of fascist crimes, the state began rounding up Golden Dawn personnel based on evidence already collected, including from wiretaps of telephone calls made by Fyssas’s killer. [wsws never mentions that vastly greater numbers of leftist crimes have gone unpunished since 1974. by the reasoning these communists use, the state is in collusion 10x more with the extreme leftists than with Golden Dawn] On Saturday, the daily Kathemerini reported that plans to move against the fascists had been in preparation for three months. “About three months before the Golden Dawn leadership was arrested,” Samaras met with “close advisers” plus “State Minister Dimitris Stamatis, Public Order Minister Nikos Dendias, government spokesman Simos Kedikoglou, ND parliamentary spokesman Makis Voridis and party secretary Andreas Papamimikos to assess his options,” Kathemerini wrote. “Dendias, [Samaras advisor Chrysanthos] Lazaridis and Voridis were in favour of exploring the option of banning the neo-Nazi party but others who took part in the meeting feared that this would only increase its popularity. The meeting concluded that the best tactic was to tackle Golden Dawn’s actions through available legal means.” Given that the European Union and the United States, working through the International Monetary Fund, have a stranglehold over Greece’s economy, it is inconceivable that Samaras would have moved against Golden Dawn without top EU and US officials’ approval. Washington and the EU did not want an explosive conflict to develop, pitting workers against both the fascist thugs and the Greek state. Former ND Justice Minister Antonis Roupakiotis said last week that the government had come under pressure to act against Golden Dawn before Greece takes over the six-month presidency of the European Council in January. A technical team of the “troika”—the European Commission, European Central Bank and IMF—arrived in Athens September 16, two days before Fyssas’s murder, to monitor the progress of Greece’s austerity programme. The “troika” immediately welcomed the clampdown on Golden Dawn. The European Commission expressed its “full confidence in the Greek justice [system] to take all necessary actions, in respect of legal procedures.” “The Greek political system has risen to the challenge and [is taking steps to] protect the democratic rule of law,” EU Commissioner Maria Damanaki stated. Following the roundup of Golden Dawn’s MPs, Samaras began a six-day official visit to the US, during which he portrayed himself as leading the struggle for democracy against both right and left “extremists.” Speaking to influential bodies including the American Jewish Committee, he stated: “There is no room for the neo-Nazis in any part of the democratic world, and there is no tolerance for the neo-Nazis, or for any kind of extremism, undermining democratic institutions. Fascism can have many faces. There is absolutely no tolerance for any of them.” Anyone opposed to the NWO's agenda is defined thereby as an extremist, and subject to legal sanction and political/media perseuction. Samaras’s rhetoric indicates his intention to utilise whatever measures are enacted against Golden Dawn in the name of fighting “extremism” and deploy them against the working class—and with far greater ferocity. [The communists are AGAINST the persecution of Golden Dawn because they fear measures taken against GD will be taken against their groups.] Since mass pauperisation in Greece began after the October 2009 election of the social-democratic PASOK party, successive governments have utilised dictatorial methods to smash strikes and protests and force through unpopular cuts. For its part, the main opposition party, Syriza (the Coalition of the Radical Left), is offering its services in a possible government of national unity as the best means of imposing austerity. Party leader Alexis Tsipras has spent considerable effort on promoting claims that the police force is being purged of its well-known connections with Golden Dawn and can be democratised, expressing similar confidence in the legal system providing it is “left alone to do its work.” On October 1, he met with representatives of the national federation of police officers to discuss the “reform” of the police service. Syriza has also repeatedly criticised New Democracy for pursuing a “strategy of tension and the theory of the two extremes,” at a time when Greek society faces the “monster of fascism and [is] realising the massive responsibility of the police and its political leadership for the spread of Nazi violence.” The government’s stance was “extremely dangerous and irresponsible” and would lead to its “further isolation from the majority of the Greek people that wanted a clear answer defending democracy from its enemies,” according to the Greek Reporter. This weekend the party issued another statement stressing its opposition to a “two extremes” theory equating Golden Dawn’s crimes with the “social struggles of the left.” To Vima wrote, “For Syriza, tackling Golden Dawn is primarily a political matter and the ‘two extremes’ theory subverts any antifascist efforts. To that end, the opposition party has requested a General Assembly in Parliament, to discuss the matter and how to safeguard democracy.” Syriza’s pitch for a governmental role is that of a party which has pledged to honour the Memorandum with the “troika,” albeit on a renegotiated basis. A government made up of any conceivable constellation of ND, PASOK, Syriza and the smaller parties of the “left” and “right” would seek to continue austerity at the expense of the workers. The ultimate political beneficiary would be Golden Dawn. It secured the support of 400,000 voters not primarily through its anti-immigrant stance, but by its denunciation of the EU, the bankers and the “establishment parties,” above all Syriza, and the trade unions for pushing through attacks on Greek workers. [interesting claim, but i wouldn't necessarily accept it. wsws commies are ideological anti-nationalists, so they are dogmatically committed to not making any distinction between illegal aliens from pakistan or algeria and greeks. most greeks don't see things that way, which is one reason it's difficult to be a communist] Only the independent social and political mobilisation of the working class in a struggle for the overthrow of capitalism and the formation of a workers’ government offers a way forward. http://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2013.../gree-o07.html Last edited by Alex Linder; October 7th, 2013 at 01:23 PM. |
October 7th, 2013 | #4873 | |
Junior Member
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 149
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The situation and especially the goals of the whole operation are not anymore clear to us than they are to you. There are currently two lines of thought. The ones who believe that the whole ordeal will lead to GD's demise, and the other (the more optimistic one) who thinks the arrests will make martyrs out of them and boost their popularity. One thing I noticed today is that the MsM seem to be getting nervous. That's because the polls and the general public seem to condemn the ZOG's actions, with well known and established lawyers taking a non-emotional hard stance against the arrests. That has led the media to a libel frenzy. Today on the news, the top story was accusing the GD of organizing mass slaughters of lambs... which would serve as training for a potential coup d'etat, or for the killing of immigrants. Desperate moves for defamation. |
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October 7th, 2013 | #4874 | |
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October 7th, 2013 | #4875 | |
Banned
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 1,491
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The Golden Dawn Murder Case: Larry Summers and the New Fascismhttp://www.gregpalast.com/the-golden...ism/#more-8710
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October 7th, 2013 | #4876 |
Administrator
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long CNN report but nothing new
http://www.cnn.com/2013/10/07/busine...right-wingers/ |
October 7th, 2013 | #4877 |
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[controlled media - euronews]
Golden Dawn MPs attend parliament opening in Greece 07/10 20:24 CET [video] Greece’s parliament has reopened with a religious blessing and the return of three far-right MPs arrested amid anger over the murder of a musician. Accused of belonging to a criminal group, the trio from the Golden Dawn party took their seats, having been freed pending trial. The party leader and two other MPs remain in custody. “We have a criminal organisation,” said Dora Bakoyannis, an MP from the conservative New Democracy party which leads the ruling coalition. “What we are going after is the criminal acts of Golden Dawn. Unfortunately, there are many, so now justice has to finish with the whole investigation.” “The problem is not deciding if they are a gang or not,” said Greek Communist MP Liana Kanelli, who made headlines worldwide when she was slapped by a member of Golden Dawn on a television programme. “The problem is now to convince people that they have never been, they are not, and they will never be the solution of any of the popular problems.” Anti-fascist protests in Greece have highlighted public anger after the left-wing rapper’s killing in Athens last month. A Golden Dawn supporter has allegedly confessed to stabbing him to death. The party denies any role but has been widely blamed for a spate of attacks on migrants. It was reported on Monday that the Greek parliament has been asked to lift the immunity from prosecution of three more Golden Dawn MPs so that they, too, can face charges of involvement in a criminal organisation. http://www.euronews.com/2013/10/07/g...ing-in-greece/ |
October 7th, 2013 | #4878 |
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[controlled media - Associated Press]
Court seeks to lift immunity for 3 Golden Dawn MPs Lawmakers of the extreme far-right Golden Dawn from bottom to top, Giorgos Germenis, Artemios Matheopoulos, Ilias Kasidiaris, Ilias Panayiotaros, and Nikos Michos attend a blessing ceremony for the upcoming parliamentary season inside the parliament hall, in Athens, Monday, Oct. 7, 2013. Monday, October 7, 2013 Associated Press ATHENS, Greece — Greece's Parliament has been asked to lift the immunity from prosecution of three lawmakers from the extremist right-wing Golden Dawn party so they can face charges of participating in a criminal organization, as part of a crackdown on the party sparked by the fatal stabbing of a left-wing rap singer.A prosecutor sent the request Monday after statements by protected witnesses indicated that legislators Giorgos Germenis, Panagiotis Iliopoulos and Stathis Boukouras were involved in military-style training of new party members or in obtaining weapons.Boukouras appeared of his own accord at court offering to testify after hearing his name mentioned in news reports about the protected witnesses' testimony.Three top Golden Dawn members, including party leader Nikos Michaloliakos, were remanded in jail last week pending trial. http://bostonherald.com/news_opinion....KrWpasYy.dpuf |
October 7th, 2013 | #4879 |
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[jew Soros]
George Soros is Chairman of Soros Fund Management and Chairman of the Open Society Foundations. Oct. 7, 2013 Angela Merkel’s Pyrrhic Victory BUDAPEST – As far as Germany is concerned, the drama of the euro crisis is over. The subject was barely discussed in the country’s recent election campaign. Chancellor Angela Merkel did what was necessary to ensure the euro’s survival, and she did so at the least possible cost to Germany – a feat that earned her the support of pro-European Germans as well as those who trust her to protect German interests. Not surprisingly, she won re-election resoundingly. But it was a Pyrrhic victory. The eurozone status quo is neither tolerable nor stable. Mainstream economists would call it an inferior equilibrium; I call it a nightmare – one that is inflicting tremendous pain and suffering that could be easily avoided if the misconceptions and taboos that sustain it were dispelled. The problem is that the debtor countries feel all the pain, while the creditors impose the misconceptions and taboos. One example is Eurobonds, which Merkel has declared taboo. Yet they are the obvious solution to the root cause of the euro crisis, which is that joining the euro exposed member countries’ government bonds to the risk of default. Normally, developed countries never default, because they can always print money. But, by ceding that authority to an independent central bank, the eurozone’s members put themselves in the position of a developing country that has borrowed in foreign currency. Neither the authorities nor the markets recognized this prior to the crisis, attesting to the fallibility of both. When the euro was introduced, the authorities actually declared member states’ government bonds to be riskless. Commercial banks could hold them without setting aside any capital reserves, and the European Central Bank (ECB) accepted them on equal terms at its discount window. This created a perverse incentive for commercial banks to buy the weaker governments’ debt in order to earn what eventually became just a few basis points, as interest-rate differentials converged to practically zero. But interest-rate convergence caused economic divergence. The weaker countries enjoyed real-estate, consumption, and investment booms, while Germany, weighed down by the fiscal burden of reunification, had to adopt austerity and implement structural reforms. That was the origin of the euro crisis, but it was not recognized at the time – and is not properly understood even today. Converting all outstanding government bonds – with the exception of Greece’s – into Eurobonds would be by far the best remedy. It would require no transfer payments, because each country would remain responsible for servicing its own debt. And it would impose stricter market discipline on debtor countries than they currently face, because they could issue Eurobonds only to refinance maturing ones; any additional borrowing would have to be in their own name, and markets would impose penalty rates for excessive borrowing. Yet Eurobonds would substantially reduce the heavily indebted countries’ borrowing costs and go a long way to reestablishing a level playing field in the eurozone. Germany’s credit rating would not be endangered, because Eurobonds would compare favorably with bonds issued by other major countries. Eurobonds would not cure disparities in competitiveness; eurozone countries would still need to undertake their own structural reforms. But they would remedy the euro’s main design flaw. All the alternatives are inferior: they either involve transfer payments, perpetuate an uneven playing field, or both. And yet, owing to Merkel’s opposition, Eurobonds cannot even be considered. Or you could get rid of the Euro and let the countries go back to running their own affairs, without any central bank except their own, which they'd be wise to get rid of too. But that would be a nationalist rather than a globalist solution. Greece, too, is a victim of its creditors’ misconceptions and taboos. Everyone knows that it can never pay back its debt, most of which is held by the official sector: the ECB, eurozone member states, or the International Monetary Fund. After undergoing a lot of pain and suffering, Greece is close to posting a primary budget surplus. If the official sector could forgo repayment as long as Greece meets the conditions imposed by the Troika (the ECB, the European Commission, and the IMF), private capital would return and the economy could recover rapidly. I can testify from personal experience that investors would flock to Greece once the debt overhang was removed. But the official sector cannot write down its debt, because that would violate a number of taboos, particularly for the ECB. Germany would do well to remember that it has benefited from debt write-downs three times in its history. The Dawes Plan of 1924 sought to stagger Germany’s reparations payments for World War I. The Young Plan of 1929 reduced the sum that Germany owed in reparations and gave the country much more time to pay. The post-World War II Marshall Plan provided debt relief as well. French insistence on harsh reparations payments after World War I clearly prepared the ground for the rise of Hitler. The rise of Greece’s neo-fascist Golden Dawn is a similar phenomenon. These two examples justify my description of the euro crisis as a nightmare. Only Germany can end it, because, as the country with the highest credit rating and largest and strongest economy by far, it is in charge. Germany, mindful of its recent history, does not want to be cast in the role of a hegemonic power; the current situation is not the result of some evil German plot. Still, Germany cannot escape the responsibilities and liabilities that go with that role. It must learn to act as a benign hegemon. Doing so would earn Germany the lasting gratitude of the countries that are currently subordinated to it, just as the Marshall Plan earned the United States the lasting gratitude of Europe. Failure to seize this moment would, I believe, lead to the disintegration and eventual collapse of the European Union. Of course, many countries have lived through nightmares and survived. But the EU is not a country; it is an incomplete association of sovereign states that will not survive a decade or more of stagnation. That is not in Germany’s interest, and it would leave Europeans worse off than they were when they embarked on the EU project. Making a U-turn is never easy for political leaders, but elections do provide an opportunity for a policy change. The best way to make one would be for Merkel’s next government to appoint an independent expert commission to evaluate the alternatives, without regard to the prevailing taboos. http://www.project-syndicate.org/com...JJ6IlzqdgFQ.99 |
October 7th, 2013 | #4880 |
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Witnesses Say Greek Golden Dawn Targeted Democracy
By Maria Papathanasiou on October 7, 2013 in Crime, News, Politics More testimony is developing in the case against leaders of the Greek neo-Nazi Golden Dawn party, particularly its Members of Parliament charged with running a criminal gang: Ilias Panagiotaros, Ilias Kasidiaris, Giorgos Germenis and Stathis Boukouras. One of the witnesses, a party member, reportedly revealed that anti-fascist hip-hop artist Pavlos Fyssas, 34, who was killed on Sept. 17 by a man police said was connected to the extremists, was a pre-meditated target. He had been very vocal against the party in his music. The witness, whose name was not given, reportedly said that he was trained by Giorgos Germenis who was called “captain” and who was the judge of “trials” against the party’s perceived enemies. According to this witness, another MP was responsible for Piraeus and the surrounding areas, Panagiotaros had the southern suburbs but they were under the command of Kasidiaris, who gave indoctrination speeches while Panagiotaros gave out special uniforms and batons. The party’s second-in-command, Christos Pappas, being held in jail pending his trial, was called “Brigadier”. The second witness was said to be a Golden Dawn member in Corinth who told an Athens court of racist attacks against “illegal immigrants in the region of Corinth” and said one occurred last year in front of police officers who laughed while it happened. Many police are reportedly aligned with the neo-Nazis as the government tries to root out wrongdoers. The witness also said that the MP representing the area, Stathis Boukouras knew about these incidents and had “an unknown number of Zastava guns.” He said also that “he had hidden guns and food, in an abandoned monastery in ancient Kleones.” Another witness said party members tried to recruit teenagers.. The third witness supported that “the target of Golden Dawn is the democracy. They used to tell us that we will enter the Parliament with tanks.” He also said that Nikos Mihos was a trainer on “how we can kill the enemy with a knife.” The witness also claimed the trainings “took place in folds on Attiki and Malakasa” where the trainers do mass slaughters of animals, in order to learn how to use the technique of blows with a knife in the carotid artery. According to the same witness, Mihos pushed against payment weapons to other members of the organization, while noting that as he had heard, “they were practicing in an isolated region of Palia Penteli.” The new testimonies reportedly could lead prosecutors to again try to have Kasidiaris and Panagiotaros, who had been temporarily released by the court pending trial, placed in custody again. http://greece.greekreporter.com/2013...ted-democracy/ |
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