Vanguard News Network
VNN Media
VNN Digital Library
VNN Reader Mail
VNN Broadcasts

Old August 7th, 2008 #1
Alex Linder
Administrator
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 45,355
Blog Entries: 34
Alex Linder
Default Hugely Overrated Authors: Evelyn Waugh

Brideshead Revisited RevisitedHow to watch Evelyn Waugh.
By Troy Patterson
Posted Friday, July 25, 2008, at 3:08 PM ET

Evelyn Waugh is the greatest comic novelist of the last 100 years, and if you somehow dispute this fact, there is simply nothing to be done for you but a period of house arrest. One or another reputable online bookseller will deliver Waugh's fiction to the doorway of your awful little warren, and you can begin your re-education at the beginning, with the debut novel Decline and Fall, wherein hero Paul Pennyfeather, cast out of Oxford for the indecent behavior of running around without any pants on, assumes a teaching job (for which he lacks all qualifications) at a school in Wales (a country disparaged in the rude, cruel, achingly hilarious terms that anticipate the author's shabby treatment of Africa). You will go onward through the dark satire, brilliant viciousness, and unmatchable dialogue of Vile Bodies, Black Mischief, and, especially, A Handful of Dust, with its stunning climactic swerve from light social comedy to perfect desolation. If you haven't been converted by the opening chapters of Scoop—about a writer, incompetent even as a nature columnist, covering a war for a paper called the Daily Beast—then there is no hope for you, and you should just stay home forever.

http://www.slate.com/id/2195923/

Waugh is not even in the same league as P.G. Wodehouse or Roald Dahl when it comes to comedy. See, you can say Scoop is funny, but I've read it. It's not.
 
Old August 10th, 2008 #2
Curtis Stone
Senior Member
 
Curtis Stone's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 2,057
Curtis Stone
Default

I tried to read BR. It was not interesting, and I think the Sebastian part was faggy, which is probably the main reason it gets promoted today. I only read about half. Nothing happened. I think there was one funny line. The message that the rich aristocrat's world has expired is the party line. That's been the message forever. Just like the Southern white's world has to be expired in all literature. It's like those tabloid magazines that try to make you feel good that you don't have any money or success, lucky you.

"All apologies to Wuthering Heights, but Brideshead Revisited has a claim as literature's finest schlock. It sees narrator Charles Ryder reflecting, with a compound of sharp rue and magniloquent longing, on his past. In his youth, there was a powerful love for beautiful and doomed aristocrat Sebastian Flyte and a failed attempt to rescue Sebastian from alcoholism; in early middle age, a thwarted romance with Sebastian's sister, Julia, and a continuing passion for the Flyte family's huge and gorgeous country house. At 39, Ryder—and, with him, the credulous reader—is convinced that the world of the Flytes has expired and, with it, an essential part of the soul of England. "
 
Old August 10th, 2008 #3
Alex Linder
Administrator
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 45,355
Blog Entries: 34
Alex Linder
Default

I havent read Brideshead Revisisted, or seen the show. I'm thinking of Scoop and A Handful of Dust. They just aren't as funny as they're claimed to be. Scoop has a couple lines where you kinda go meh... but that's about it. Roald Dahl, Mencken, Twain, Wodehouse- these are where the comedy is. Saki too, very good stuff.
 
Old August 12th, 2008 #4
steven clark
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,706
steven clark
Default

True, but I like Waugh. When I was in the army, i read five novels one aftrer another in a week. I am rereading Brideshead, but also liked reading a smaller work of his, Scott-King's Modern Europe (1947), where an Englsih scholar has a wacky time lecturing in a Franco/Communist like country in S. Europe.
Among the lines:
"Nowadays, most of us have no choice but to lead useless lives."
"Nowadays, it is not what you do that counts, but who informs against you."
"In Neutralia," said Dr. Arturo Fey,..."when we are happy, we take no account of time. Today, we are very happy."
"Do you think," he asked, "that in Neutralia wester culture might be born again? That this country has been preserved by destiny from the horrors of war so that it can become a beacon of hope for the world?"
"No," said Scott-KIng.
"Do you not?", asked Dr. Antonic anxiously, "do you not? Neither do I?"
As for Brideshead, George Orwell said it is hard to remain Catholic and grown-up at the same time.
 
Old August 13th, 2008 #5
Alex Linder
Administrator
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 45,355
Blog Entries: 34
Alex Linder
Default

I just don't think British are funny in general, at least not the ones you hear about. Monty Python isn't funny. Not any more frequently than Saturday Night Live, which is hardly ever funny. Benny Hill was funnier and more talented than the whole Cleese crew x 10. Wodehouse, Saki and Dahl - there's nothing in Shakespeare 1/10th as funny as these guys come up with, nor is there anything tragic, for that matter. Shakespeare is fluent and fluid as any writer, but his tragedies are unaffecting and his comedies aren't funny. The funny part is watching middle-class people react to them the way they think they're supposed to. They know Shakespeare is great because they've been told it. What kind of cheap knowledge is that?

Waugh isn't offensive, he's just another one of these that, like Chesterton, is so built up that when you read it, you go WTF? How can all these people whose judgment I respected be so wrong? Chesterton is a wit and a wise man to people too dumb to see his pathetic tricks. He's the Zalinsky to the conserva-nerds. Because they don't know any better, and he's a helluv- well, a prolific excreter of words.
 
Old August 13th, 2008 #6
Mike Jahn
Banned
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 7,526
Blog Entries: 3
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex Linder View Post
I just don't think British are funny in general, at least not the ones you hear about. Monty Python isn't funny. Not any more frequently than Saturday Night Live, which is hardly ever funny. Benny Hill was funnier and more talented than the whole Cleese crew x 10. Wodehouse, Saki and Dahl - there's nothing in Shakespeare 1/10th as funny as these guys come up with, nor is there anything tragic, for that matter. Shakespeare is fluent and fluid as any writer, but his tragedies are unaffecting and his comedies aren't funny. The funny part is watching middle-class people react to them the way they think they're supposed to. They know Shakespeare is great because they've been told it. What kind of cheap knowledge is that?

Waugh isn't offensive, he's just another one of these that, like Chesterton, is so built up that when you read it, you go WTF? How can all these people whose judgment I respected be so wrong? Chesterton is a wit and a wise man to people too dumb to see his pathetic tricks. He's the Zalinsky to the conserva-nerds. Because they don't know any better, and he's a helluv- well, a prolific excreter of words.
I despise Anglophilia in all its forms. I agree that British humor is not funny, and I detest Americans who think that by displaying an interest in British pop culture, literature, it makes them appear high-brow. Generally I find that people who identify with Britain without having actual British roots just get off on the snobbish implications associated with English accents.
 
Old August 13th, 2008 #7
Nick Apleece
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Posts: 643
Nick Apleece
Default

A few years ago I started reading the so-called Great Books in an effort to broaden my horizons a bit. I agree that Evelyn Waugh is hugely overrated. Even if you ignore the implied queer relationship in Brideshead Revisited, it's just plain boring, filled with stilted prose and unsympathetic characters.

I didn't get it at the time, but I came to realize that people like it because they're supposed to like it, not because it's actually any good. Just like with modern art, it's a product of jewish brainwashing of middle-class Whites who want to feel superior to lower-class Whites by appearing cultured and intellectual.

I'd add John Steinbeck (rambling, hyperbolic) and James Joyce (incomprehensible) to the list of overrated authors.

Speaking of modern art, how about this pretentious shit?



Painted by the Jew Mark Rothko (Rothkowitz), it sold for 22.5 million dollars.

This one sold for $73 million!

According to the kikes and their goy toadies, if you don't see the genius in those paintings, you're a simpleton who just doesn't get it.
 
Old August 13th, 2008 #8
steven clark
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,706
steven clark
Default

Before he died, George Orwell was going to write an essay on Waugh. Here are some notes he made:
'W's driving forces. Snobbery. Catholicism.
But note the persistant snobbishness, rising in the social scale but always centering around the idea of continuity/aristocracy/a country house. Note that Waugh's loyalty is to a form of society no longer viable, of which he must be aware.'
'Analyze BRIDESHEAD REVISITED. Studiously detatched attitude....Real theme-Sebastien's drunkenness & family's unwillingness to cure all this at the expense of committing a sin. Note that this is a real departure from the humanist attitude, with which no compromise is possible.'

Usually in much British humor, foreigners are always a joke. Americans
especially. I wonder how valid this is now, since much of Britain is for all
intents made up of foreigners, and Marxist humor is always rather lacking.
Interesting comments made here on Shakespeare. I'd disagree about him being funny and tragic, but your commetns on people liking something because they think they OUGHT to is perceptive and good. I'm reminded of a theatre group here (and other cities) that put on nothing but English plays, especially 1900 era. A real middle-class cult for that kind of stuff, and I find most all these plays tedious and removed from reality, abnd like 90% of all British humor, is built on the class system. If you aren't a Lord or have no estate, you're a joke. Haw-haw.
 
Old September 8th, 2008 #9
Troy Alexander
Nice shot Troy you got him
 
Troy Alexander's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: London
Posts: 2,332
Blog Entries: 1
Troy Alexander
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex Linder View Post
Brideshead Revisited RevisitedHow to watch Evelyn Waugh.
By Troy Patterson
Posted Friday, July 25, 2008, at 3:08 PM ET

Evelyn Waugh is the greatest comic novelist of the last 100 years, and if you somehow dispute this fact, there is simply nothing to be done for you but a period of house arrest. One or another reputable online bookseller will deliver Waugh's fiction to the doorway of your awful little warren, and you can begin your re-education at the beginning, with the debut novel Decline and Fall, wherein hero Paul Pennyfeather, cast out of Oxford for the indecent behavior of running around without any pants on, assumes a teaching job (for which he lacks all qualifications) at a school in Wales (a country disparaged in the rude, cruel, achingly hilarious terms that anticipate the author's shabby treatment of Africa). You will go onward through the dark satire, brilliant viciousness, and unmatchable dialogue of Vile Bodies, Black Mischief, and, especially, A Handful of Dust, with its stunning climactic swerve from light social comedy to perfect desolation. If you haven't been converted by the opening chapters of Scoop—about a writer, incompetent even as a nature columnist, covering a war for a paper called the Daily Beast—then there is no hope for you, and you should just stay home forever.

http://www.slate.com/id/2195923/

Waugh is not even in the same league as P.G. Wodehouse or Roald Dahl when it comes to comedy. See, you can say Scoop is funny, but I've read it. It's not.
I agree he is not as good as Dahl in terms of comedy. However, hgis critique of society and his prophecy of what is to come has not been surpassed. Have you ever read his book "a handful of dust".
 
Old July 14th, 2011 #10
RonPrice
Registered User
 
RonPrice's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: George Town Tasmania
Posts: 9
RonPrice
Default Brideshead revisited

In the six months between December 1943 and June 1944 the novel Brideshead Revisited was written in England. In those same months I existed in utero on the other side of the Atlantic in Canada. When Evelyn Waugh, the author of this novel, wrote his preface to the revised edition in 1959, and Fr. Ronald Knox published his biography of Waugh in that same year---I was 15 and had just joined the Baha’i Faith. I have remained a Baha’i all my life.

Waugh converted to Roman Catholicism in his late 20s and remained a Catholic although, as Martin Stannard the author of a two-volume biography of Waugh noted, “he struggled against the dryness of his soul”1 in the end, a common enough experience for believers of all Faiths and non-believers of all philosophies alike. Stannard saw Waugh as “the greatest novelist of his generation.”2-Ron Price with thanks to 1Martin Stannard, "Evelyn Arthur St John Waugh (1903–66),” Oxford Dictionary of National Biography, online edition, 2007; and 2Evelyn Waugh: The Early Years 1903-1939, and Evelyn Waugh: The Later Years 1939-1966, 1987 and 1992, resp., W.W. Norton & Co., NY., V.2, p.492.

Without Christianity you saw
civilization doomed or, as you
put it in your conversion: “it is
like stepping out of a Looking-
Glass world, where everything
Is an absurd caricature, into the
real world God made…..and then
begins the delicious process of….
exploring it limitlessly.”1….This is
perhaps the most succinct and
sufficient description of the process
of conversion ever written for man.

Waugh's own conversion from the "absurd
caricature" of ultra-modernity to the "real
world" of Catholic orthodoxy was greeted
with astonishment by the literary world &
caused a sensation in the media. Do those
who have watched Brideshead in these last
30 years know any of this?....I did not until
today &, wanting to know something about
how this television series came into existence
in these last thirty years: ‘81-’11…..I learned
a thing or two from a little research/reading.

1“Today we can see it on all sides as the active negation of all that Western culture has stood for. Civilization - and by this I do not mean talking cinemas and tinned food, nor even surgery and hygienic houses, but the whole moral and artistic organization of Europe - has not in itself the power of survival. It came into being through Christianity and, without, it has no significance or power to command allegiance. The loss of faith in Christianity and the consequential lack of confidence in moral and social standards have become embodied in the ideal of a materialistic, mechanized state. It is no longer possible to accept the benefits of civilization and at the same time deny the supernatural basis upon which it rests."

Waugh concluded this press statement on his conversion by saying that he saw Catholicism as the "most complete and vital form" of Christianity. The article from which the above is taken was written by Joseph Pearce and it appeared in Lay Witness a publication of Catholic United for the Faith, Inc., an international lay apostolate founded in 1968.

Ron Price
14 July 2011
 
Old July 18th, 2011 #11
Matthaus Hetzenauer
Wutta maroon!
 
Matthaus Hetzenauer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: In my comfy rabbit hole. Wut's it to ya, doitbag?
Posts: 5,687
Matthaus Hetzenauer
Default

Funny I should run into this just now...

I attempted Brideshead within the past week. I say attempted because after the first few chapters or so I just couldn't stomach one of the novel's chief characters any longer -- the blatantly-open homosexual "college chum" of Waugh's, Anthony Blanche; it was positively sickening. I'm just glad I picked it up for a mere pittance at a library book sale some months back and didn't pay full price; then I would've shit.

I do have a dogeared copy of The Oxford Companion to English Literature that I've used for the past 20 years as a review guide, before purchasing novels. I got lazy this time and, though it really didn't cost me anything monetarily-speaking, I paid for it with something just as precious: time. Live and learn, eh?
__________________
Wit' jews ya lose; wit' rope deah's hope.
- Bugs
 
Old July 18th, 2011 #12
Susan
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 3,403
Susan
Default

You're right about A Handful of Dust. I have the movie and the ending just literally pulls the rug out from under you.

One of those strange stories about very rich people who have children and never spend a moment with them as they're too busy having affairs, etc.

And then the ending which seemingly comes out of nowhere.
 
Old July 20th, 2011 #13
Matthaus Hetzenauer
Wutta maroon!
 
Matthaus Hetzenauer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: In my comfy rabbit hole. Wut's it to ya, doitbag?
Posts: 5,687
Matthaus Hetzenauer
Default

Another hugely overrated author is Jack Kerouac. I had the (dis)pleasure of reading his On the Road back in the '70s, thinking it would be a somewhat "cool" statement/take on 1950's America written by the much-lauded "Beat Generation" author. The book was, even as my malleable 18-year-old-at-the-time mind well suspected it might be, nothing more than a piece of trash; putting to ink the road journal of an "angst-ridden" (aww, poor baby!) twenty-something punk who criss-crosses the country and does nothing but indulge his alcohol- and sexually-obsessed fantasies with an assorted mix of good-for-nothings every bit as fucked up in the head as he is. A sampling: Towards the end of the book, he and a buddy wind up, via their beat-up jalopy, in a shithole of a town deep in Mexico. They score a bag of low-quality weed from an adolescent mexcrement which gives Kerouac pause to rave about the utter "beauty" and "soulness" of the "Fooled anudda gringo! " kid. (Just imagine the fawning accolades if Timothy Leary had laid a good hit of acid on the chump...Christ, you'd need a pair of waders just to make your way through all the knee-deep-in-the-hoopla bullshit).

btw-- Tonight at 10:15 EST, TCM is broadcasting the 1949 rendition of Flaubert's Madame Bovary. I'm just wondering how true it'll be to the novel. It's been given a four-star rating; then again, any nigger-made, nigger-oriented movie will receive the same rating, so take that for what it's worth...
__________________
Wit' jews ya lose; wit' rope deah's hope.
- Bugs
 
Old July 22nd, 2011 #14
Hunter Morrow
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 1,802
Hunter Morrow
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex Linder View Post
I just don't think British are funny in general, at least not the ones you hear about.
Sure, its easy to bust the chops of mainstream stuff but I've always thought that Brits were and have the potential to be tremendously funny, particularly in television series. The Young Ones springs right to mind.

I tried reading Waugh, namely Brideshead Revisited and A Handful of Dust and
I sincerely wish I hadn't. There is something pathological within me that just refuses to put down a book, no matter how much of a boring slog it is.

I didn't see what was so dark or comedic about his output. I'd just as soon read some Melville or Twain at their most bitter.

This is absolutely not high brow enough for the discussion, but my God I will never understand the appeal of Tolkien. Absolutely horrible trash, 4th rate renditions of existing mythology and religions. The real sin is that his success is responsible for trillions of hackneyed ripoffs. Throughout my life, from childhood on I've always loved fables and myths and fantasy output of all kinds but I just can't get into Tolkien and it drives me nuts.
 
Old July 23rd, 2011 #15
David Langdon
Senior Member
 
David Langdon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: United Kingdom (of Africa and Asia)
Posts: 542
David Langdon
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex Linder View Post
I just don't think British are funny in general, at least not the ones you hear about. Monty Python isn't funny. Not any more frequently than Saturday Night Live, which is hardly ever funny. Benny Hill was funnier and more talented than the whole Cleese crew x 10.
Agreed. Over here it's worse than blasphemy to say you don't find monty python funny. Ripping Yarns was ok though. Benny Hill was great.

Overrated author - J D Salinger.
 
Old July 23rd, 2011 #16
P.E.
Geriatric Coalburner
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 1,825
P.E.
Default

Pretty much all acclaimed female authors belong on such a list, primarily because a great many of them came to light in the 20th century, and many of them are Jewesses.

How about Ayn Rand? Why, look at all of those 5-star reviews on Amazon for Atlas Shrugged. OVER A THOUSAND!

Were she not blowing smoke up peoples asses about money, were her words not revolving around that very foundation propping up all of her tacky Jewess scribble and about simultaneous orgasm on the floor of some cargo train with her fifth fuck of the day having not even showered between fucks because she's too busy counting her shekels, that book would've had 10 reviews from some fringe Jews trying to help her out, and she would've been arm-in-arm with Gloria Steinam and Bella Abzug in the Jewess Catfish Mouth Slutmarch.

In all reality, she's little different from Tony Robbins. Their writings target the same crowd of people, and I would not be surprised if those who keep their books around have titles from both authors, as much as those people are probably very unhealthy, ugly, stressed out and asocial.

Ah, I still have my copy of Atlas Shrugged from 5 or so years ago. It will make a fine start to the first crackles of the fireplace this winter. All of my books are on my Xoom now anyway. EZPdf reader doesn't get dusty.

Last edited by P.E.; July 23rd, 2011 at 02:33 PM.
 
Old July 23rd, 2011 #17
Leonard Rouse
Celebrating My Diversity
 
Leonard Rouse's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: With The Creepy-Ass Crackahs
Posts: 8,156
Leonard Rouse
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by P.E. View Post
Were she not blowing smoke up peoples asses about money, were her words not revolving around that very foundation propping up all of her tacky Jewess scribble and about simultaneous orgasm on the floor of some cargo train with her fifth fuck of the day having not even showered between fucks because she's too busy counting her shekels, that book would've had 10 reviews from some fringe Jews trying to help her out, and she would've been arm-in-arm with Gloria Steinam and Bella Abzug in the Jewess Catfish Mouth Slutmarch.


Yep, she's got the mouth. Need a big lure for those hags.

http://www.vnnforum.com/showthread.php?t=109040
 
Old July 23rd, 2011 #18
Rick Ronsavelle
Senior Member
 
Rick Ronsavelle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 4,006
Rick Ronsavelle
Default

". . .I have the movie and the ending just literally pulls the rug out from under you. . ."

Literally?? Of good. I assume you have video. . .

 
Old June 6th, 2012 #19
RonPrice
Registered User
 
RonPrice's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: George Town Tasmania
Posts: 9
RonPrice
Default More on Jack Kerouac

ROADMAP
IN 1959

In the 1950s and 1960s there were evolving etymologies for the word beat. In "The Origins of the Beat Generation," originally published in Playboy magazine in 1959, the year I joined the Bahá'í Faith, the beat poet Jack Kerouac wrote that the word beat originally meant poor, down and out, deadbeat, on the bum, sad and sleeping in subways. He further noted that the word had gained an extended meaning connoting people who "have a certain new gesture, or attitude.”(1) Kerouac suffused the label with positive connotations, a move he later extended into giving "beat" a religious significance. The Beats were for a time, in this evolving etymology, saints in the making who were walking the Earth doing good deeds in the name of sanctitude, holiness and the beatific. There was certainly an element of this in the Bahá'í ethos of the Ten Year Crusade of 1953-1963.

Kerouac had at one stage claimed that "beat" was the second religiousness in Western Civilization that the historian Oswald Spengler had prophesized in his Decline of the West in 1918.(2) But, by 1965, he had changed this view of the beats, the beatniks, the counter-culture and, in fact, strongly denounced its entire ethos. By the mid-soaring sixties he had come to see that generation of dissent and dissenters as the very opposite of Spengler’s second-religiousness. He called it “a soaring hysteria.”(3) -Ron Price with thanks to (1) Jack Kerouac, "The Origins of the Beat Generation," in Don Allen, ed., Good Blonde and Others Grey Fox Press, San Francisco, 1994, p. 61; (2) ibid., p.66 and (3) Ann Charters, ed., Jack Kerouac: Selected Letters 1957-1969, Penguin Books, NY, 1999, p. 464.

Your notion of Beat as a Spenglerian
second coming ended in a very bitter
disappointment—millennialbeliever
whose apocalypse just never arrived.
You denied all political---collectivist
implications for the beats & beatniks.

You had used the term back in 1951 to
describe guys who ran around the land
and country in cars looking for jobs and
girlfriends, kicks and fun.You remained
an on-again off-again beat.....throughout
your life, flirting with many religions but
always infusing them with a dose of your
Catholicism to which you ultimately went
back for its order, tenderness and piety as
you put in in one of your many letters.....

The word "beat" had extended to cover
all of America by the end of the sixties
and most of the world..youngsters used
your On the Road as a search-roadmap.(1)
But you abdicated your status as King of
the Road as well as King of the Beats.(2)

(1) Jack Kerouac(1922-1969), On the Road, 1957.
(2) I thank Bent Sørensen for his: “An On & Off Beat: Kerouac's Beat Etymologies,” in philament: An Online Journal of Arts and Culture, April, 2004.

Ron Price
2 January 2010
 
Old June 7th, 2012 #20
White Winger
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 5,234
White Winger
Default

ALL the Beat writers were hugely overrated.

Every Existentialist,

Any author labled as Socially/Politically significant - Leftist euphemism for Marxist,Socialist, lustful for Leftist Totalitarians, anti-American,anti-White,White Guilter,

Harper Lee - only 1 book,but....
Norman Mailer.
Gore Vidal
Phillip Roth
John Updike
James Michener
Hunter Thompson
Sinclair Lewis
Lillian Hellman
Harriet Beecher Stowe
Virginia Woolfe
John Steinbeck


Every member of The Algonquin Round Table

And,of course, nigger authors.
 
Reply

Tags
evelyn waugh, famous anti semite

Share


Thread
Display Modes


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:02 PM.
Page generated in 0.15373 seconds.