Vanguard News Network
VNN Media
VNN Digital Library
VNN Reader Mail
VNN Broadcasts

Old August 6th, 2008 #1
Alex Linder
Administrator
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 45,756
Blog Entries: 34
Default The Comparative: More or -er?

"A hat should be taken off when you greet a lady and left off for the rest of your life. Nothing looks more stupid than a hat." --P. J. O'Rourke

Good line, but marred by 'more stupid' as opposed to the correct 'stupider.' On the surface it might seem that using the technically incorrect 'more stupid' reinforces the sense of the quotation, 'stupider' is both the correct and it allows the emphasis to fall in the right place.

In general, -er should be preferred to 'more.' Er usually sounds better and is almost always funnier. Few things are inherently as funny as comparatives made of the appended 'er.'
 
Old August 6th, 2008 #2
hengest
Banned
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: britain
Posts: 1,214
Wink

Correct grammar, punctuation and even spelling are becoming a thing of the past.
Contrary to the liberal establishment's view, though, it IS important and it DOES matter, for it codifies and sets a standard for written communication, without which, there ensues confusion and ambiguity of meaning and intent.
Without a common ground for understanding, communication of ideas becomes troublesome or even impossible.
Having said all that though, I wouldn't go as far as Alex's nitpicking.

Last edited by hengest; August 6th, 2008 at 08:58 PM. Reason: I made a spelling mistake. Twice!
 
Old August 6th, 2008 #3
Horseman
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,705
Default

1. Nothing looks more stupid than a hat.
2. Nothing looks stupider than a hat.

I think this statement is a little stupid. I see no problem with hats. I think he needs to distract from the stupidity of the statement by using incorrect grammar.
 
Old August 6th, 2008 #4
Metal Warrior
Leaving a bruise
 
Metal Warrior's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Land o' Bears, PA
Posts: 1,652
Default

Yeah, but..."funner" or "more fun"? Younger people tend to use the former. I recall some rule that one-syllable words should have "more" attached for the comparative. Was I just half-asleep that day?
__________________
This message is hidden because Dan_O is on your ignore list.
This message is hidden because N.M. Valdez is on your ignore list.
 
Old August 6th, 2008 #5
Alex Linder
Administrator
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 45,756
Blog Entries: 34
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by hengest View Post
Correct grammar, punctuation and even spelling are becoming a thing of the past.
Contrary to the liberal establishment's view, though, it IS important and it DOES matter, for it codifies and sets a standard for written communication, without which, there ensues confusion and ambiguity of meaning and intent.
Without a common ground for understanding, communication of ideas becomes troublesome or even impossible.
Having said all that though, I wouldn't go as far as Alex's nitpicking.
I don't pretend that I am a first-rate grammarian. I know what's right and wrong, but can't always cite the rule. I do pretend to be, and am, a first-rate speller.

Now, it is not nitpicking to say that the correct comparative for stupid is stupider, not more stupid. More stupid, I believe, I could be wrong, is technically incorrect. The correct form is: stupid, stupider, stupidest.

You don't say, that is the most stupid thing i ever heard of, you say that is the stupidest thing I ever heard of.

Now, it is is possible that the O'Rourke quotation is a misquote - a very common thing. I have read pretty much everything O'Rourke ever wrote, but twenty years ago when he was at at his best.

Last edited by Alex Linder; August 6th, 2008 at 09:20 PM.
 
Old August 6th, 2008 #6
Alex Linder
Administrator
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 45,756
Blog Entries: 34
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Horseman View Post
1. Nothing looks more stupid than a hat.
2. Nothing looks stupider than a hat.

I think this statement is a little stupid. I see no problem with hats. I think he needs to distract from the stupidity of the statement by using incorrect grammar.
That's his opinion, and as you know opinions are like armpits, everybody has at least two and they all stink.

I think he should have said not hats but baseball caps.
 
Old August 6th, 2008 #7
Alex Linder
Administrator
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 45,756
Blog Entries: 34
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Metal Warrior View Post
Yeah, but..."funner" or "more fun"? Younger people tend to use the former. I recall some rule that one-syllable words should have "more" attached for the comparative. Was I just half-asleep that day?
More fun is correct. Funner is absolutely incorrect. It has become common only in the last 15 years.
 
Old August 6th, 2008 #8
OTPTT
Banned
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 9,896
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex Linder View Post
I don't pretend that I am a first-rate grammarian. I do pretend, and am, a first-rate speller.
I have a first rate browser that spell checks as I type. I try to spell correctly but occasionally I slip up on a certain word. The spell checker comes in handy and is built into the Firefox browser.
 
Old August 6th, 2008 #9
Alex Linder
Administrator
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 45,756
Blog Entries: 34
Default

We may just have to have a language subforum. Am thinking about this in relation to banning morons and thwopping illiterates who otherwise needn't be banned. Hmmm, me and Stritch "Rick" Swayze will put our heads together and come up with something.
 
Old August 6th, 2008 #10
Alex Linder
Administrator
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 45,756
Blog Entries: 34
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by OTPTT View Post
I have a first rate browser that spell checks as I type. I try to spell correctly but occasionally I slip up on a certain word. The spell checker comes in handy and is built into the Firefox browser.
Another peeve of mine is the failure to use the hyphen. 'First rate' as an adjective is always hyphenated.
 
Old August 6th, 2008 #11
cillian
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 6,377
Default

Does anyone know what these ~ are for?
Or the difference between {[ and (
 
Old August 6th, 2008 #12
Alex Linder
Administrator
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 45,756
Blog Entries: 34
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cillian View Post
Does anyone know what these ~ are for?
Or the difference between {[ and (
~ means about in English. It might have other meanings i'm not familiar with. If it's over an 'n' in spanish, it changes the sound to an 'ny' as in 'canyon.' but that's in spanish.

[ ] brackets. used for editorial comments, to distinguish the editor's words from the author's. of course, also used in math equations. also, if you have parenthetical material in something you're writing and need parentheses inside that, then that nested material is placed between brackets. so: (blah blah blah blah blah [blah blah blah] blah blah blah)
 
Old August 6th, 2008 #13
Alex Linder
Administrator
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 45,756
Blog Entries: 34
Default

~ is usually used with numbers. about 200 = ~200
 
Old August 6th, 2008 #14
OTPTT
Banned
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 9,896
Default

An audio book for those interested.

English Vocabulary Booster
 
Old August 6th, 2008 #15
Anchorage Activist
Senior Member
 
Anchorage Activist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: The Last Frontier
Posts: 1,420
Default

I was just checking Yahoo Answers, and there doesn't seem to be a clear consensus on whether or not "stupider" is a legitimate word. It does sound awkward to me.

But I suppose that if one can say "dumber", it is not inconsistent to say "stupider".

I favor policing obvious spelling errors and punctuation misconstructions more rigorously. But I question whether it would be wise to launch a full-scale grammar pogrom. That would be a bit "stormfrontish".
 
Old August 6th, 2008 #16
Alex Linder
Administrator
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 45,756
Blog Entries: 34
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anchorage Activist View Post
But I suppose that if one can say "dumber", it is not inconsistent to say "stupider".
The comparative of dumb has no necessary relation to stupid just because the words mean similar things.

Stupider is the correct word. Sometimes either way is correct, but certainly most stupid is wrong, therefore more stupid must be wrong too.
 
Old August 6th, 2008 #17
Peer Fischer
Senior Member
 
Peer Fischer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 4,921
Default

On the tilde (~):

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tilde

Note that while it commonly means "approximately" in mathematics, it can also mean a negation in logic (~p = not p.)



On brackets:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bracket

I won't even try to summarize this one. It gets pretty hairy, esp. in mathematical usage.

I do know that usage of parentheses and brackets is different in American English and British English. In American English, you use parentheses first, then brackets inside the parentheses if needed ([]). In British English it's the opposite [()].
 
Old August 6th, 2008 #18
odin
Nuthin' But Luv, Baby
 
odin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 5,280
Default

Copied from somewhere. I didn't note the site location.


Forming Comparative and Superlative Adjectives
One-syllable adjectives.
Form the comparative and superlative forms of a one-syllable adjective by adding –er for the comparative form and –est for the superlative.

One-Syllable Adjective Comparative Form Superlative Form
tall taller tallest
old older oldest
long longer longest

Mary is taller than Max.
Mary is the tallest of all the students.
Max is older than John.
Of the three students, Max is the oldest.
My hair is longer than your hair.
Max's story is the longest story I've ever heard.
If the one-syllable adjective ends with an e, just add –r for the comparative form and –st for the superlative form.

One-Syllable Adjective with Final -e Comparative Form Superlative Form
large larger largest
wise wiser wisest

Mary's car is larger than Max's car.
Mary's house is the tallest of all the houses on the block.
Max is wiser than his brother.
Max is the wisest person I know.
If the one-syllable adjective ends with a single consonant with a vowel before it, double the consonant and add –er for the comparative form; and double the consonant and add –est for the superlative form.

One-Syllable Adjective Ending with a Single Consonant with a Single Vowel before It Comparative Form Superlative Form
big bigger biggest
thin thinner thinnest
fat fatter fattest

My dog is bigger than your dog.
My dog is the biggest of all the dogs in the neighborhood.
Max is thinner than John.
Of all the students in the class, Max is the thinnest.
My mother is fatter than your mother.
Mary is the fattest person I've ever seen.
Two-syllable adjectives.
With most two-syllable adjectives, you form the comparative with more and the superlative with most.

Two-Syllable Adjective Comparative Form Superlative Form
peaceful more peaceful most peaceful
pleasant more pleasant most pleasant
careful more careful most careful
thoughtful more thoughtful most thoughtful
This morning is more peaceful than yesterday morning.
Max's house in the mountains is the most peaceful in the world.
Max is more careful than Mike.
Of all the taxi drivers, Jack is the most careful.
Jill is more thoughtful than your sister.
Mary is the most thoughtful person I've ever met.
If the two-syllable adjectives ends with –y, change the y to i and add –er for the comparative form. For the superlative form change the y to i and add –est.

Two-Syllable Adjective Ending with -y Comparative Form Superlative Form
happy happier happiest
angry angrier angriest
busy busier busiest

John is happier today than he was yesterday.
John is the happiest boy in the world.
Max is angrier than Mary.
Of all of John's victims, Max is the angriest.
Mary is busier than Max.
Mary is the busiest person I've ever met.
Two-syllable adjectives ending in –er, -le, or –ow take –er and –est to form the comparative and superlative forms.

Two-Syllable Adjective Ending with -er, -le, or -ow Comparative Form Superlative Form
narrow narrower narrowest
gentle gentler gentlest

The roads in this town are narrower than the roads in the city.
This road is the narrowest of all the roads in California.
Big dogs are gentler than small dogs.
Of all the dogs in the world, English Mastiffs are the gentlest.
Adjectives with three or more syllables.
For adjectives with three syllables or more, you form the comparative with more and the superlative with most.

Adjective with Three or More Syllables Comparative Form Superlative Form
generous more generous most generous
important more important most important
intelligent more intelligent most intelligent

John is more generous than Jack.
John is the most generous of all the people I know.
Health is more important than money.
Of all the people I know, Max is the most important.
Women are more intelligent than men.
Mary is the most intelligent person I've ever met.
Exceptions.
Irregular adjectives.

Irregular Adjective Comparative Form Superlative Form
good better best
bad worse worst
far farther farthest
little less least
many more most

Italian food is better than American food.
My dog is the best dog in the world.
My mother's cooking is worse than your mother's cooking.
Of all the students in the class, Max is the worst.
Two-syllable adjectives that follow two rules. These adjectives can be used with -er and -est and with more and most.

Two-Syllable Adjective Comparative Form Superlative Form
clever cleverer cleverest
clever more clever most clever
gentle gentler gentlest
gentle more gentle most gentle
friendly friendlier friendliest
friendly more friendly most friendly
quiet quieter quietest
quiet more quiet most quiet
simple simpler simplest
simple more simple most simple

Big dogs are gentler than small dogs.
Of all the dogs in the world, English Mastiffs are the gentlest.
Big dogs are more gentle than small dogs.
Of all the dogs in the world, English Mastiffs are the most gentle
 
Old August 6th, 2008 #19
odin
Nuthin' But Luv, Baby
 
odin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 5,280
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peer Fischer View Post
On the tilde (~):

Note that while it commonly means "approximately" in mathematics, it can also mean a negation in logic (~p = not p.)
I think it means the same thing in both instances, doesn't it? "Approximately" and "not quite equal to" are basically synonyms.
 
Old August 6th, 2008 #20
Alex Linder
Administrator
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 45,756
Blog Entries: 34
Default

In recent years there has been a move to use the more comparative, and away from -er. I fight that trend. In fact, I use -er even where more is correct. -er produces a comedic effect that can't be beat!

Dumb and Dumberer!

Curiouser and curiouser.
 
Reply

Share


Thread
Display Modes


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:31 PM.
Page generated in 2.29445 seconds.