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May 4th, 2012 | #41 | |
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A little consideration ought to be given to the fact that for all its flaws, NSM is the only White group consistenly showing up around the nation wherever Whites are under pressure. That has to count for something. The larger point is that people are continually being sidetracked into irrelevancies over dress when the proper focus is on verbal and political techniques used by the NS. There is no acknowledgement of the great wisdom discovered and written up by the original Nazis, which is on display at calvin.edu. No, all our bright boys just ignore that stuff out of hand, like Hitler and Goebbels have nothing to teach. They have more to teach us in America 2012 than any set of people you can find in American history. That's pretty strange, if you think about it, but I believe it's true. It's a testament to jews remaining the same as they ever were, just equipped with new technology to amplify their same old smears. Did Hitler go on and on about being safe, legal, respectable, appropriate, responsible? Did he act like MacDonald and Parrott and the rest of the functional conservatives who believe they are WN? Or did he define his tactics by the light of what he meant to accomplish or die trying? You see the difference there, guys? Hitler didn't care about anything but accomplishing his mission. You care about what others think of you first, and your mission only secondarily. Do the jews care about what others think of them? No. They routinely shit on everyone else, disrespect them, mock their traditions, their religious figures, their culture, their ancestors. Winners go after their goals. Women and losers worry about their makeup. E.e. cummings said it best: who pays any attention to the syntax of things will never wholly kiss you Nor will he lead any successful revolution. |
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May 4th, 2012 | #42 | |
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May 4th, 2012 | #43 | |
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Libertarianism's defense of specific freedoms white men need to live is tremendously attractive to the best whites among our race, and by that token implicitly eugenic. And aren't we all about racial improvement. We are not just whites, we are individual white men too. To answer your question, we need a new system that fits both our individual and our collective needs and nature. NS is not that system. White-man-ism, so to speak, is. Where can you find white-man-ism outlined? Why, below in the forum, my friend. [links needs supplied] |
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May 4th, 2012 | #44 |
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'National socialism' - what does the socialism add that isn't comprehended in nationalism, properly understood? Nothing.
We are going to have a group existence as a race, or, in Europe, a race and a subrace, as that is what we want, and that is what provides the context in which our individuals can flourish in all their collective and individual glory. No one will be allowed to destroy the racial basis of the state, and if he tries, he will be executed. Simple. Easy. Clear. Anyone who doesn't like it will die fighting its establishment, leave after its founding, or be kicked out if he is born into it and discovers he'd prefer to live among jungle boolies. Protecting the racial basis of the state, which is the only legitimate function of the national government, is hardly going to interfere with the average individual's freedom much at all. It's merely an insistence that he not do things that destroy the collective, and a willingness and ability to destroy him if he tries. Last edited by Alex Linder; May 4th, 2012 at 12:21 PM. |
May 4th, 2012 | #45 | |
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The attraction of Paul is he manifestly believes his own bullshit. And the minute he says stuff he manifestly does not believe - MLK sucking - his support disintegrates. Even more evidence that someone combining Paul's position with racial honesty could do even better. Of course, you need more than just one old man pushing this stuff, you'd need as many veterans and true believers as you could muster. But if you could muster it, the support very visibly is there, as Fowler points out. Paul appeals to whites screwed by the system. He fights the individual laws and policies that affect whites, without pointing out the racial targeting and animus behind those laws and policies. Paul is, in most ways, a functional white nationalist. Whereas most WN who complain about Paul (but not Greg Johnson), are functional conservatives. |
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May 4th, 2012 | #46 |
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So- we want a White area with maximum freedom. The Naturalization Act of 1790 says the country is open to "free White persons." So the USA was not founded as a proposition nation. So the basic purpose of VNN is restoring real America- real White America. Individual rights, for Whites.
So can can White Libertarian eyes be brought over here? |
May 4th, 2012 | #47 | |
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I like Paul for the additional reason he proves what I'm saying: sticking to your guns, your principles, will attract people. Because it is almost unheard of in British-derived cultures like America's. Taking the personaliy out and putting the principle in - that's what Paul does. Hitler was both principled and charismatic. We could learn a lot from a Hitler. |
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May 4th, 2012 | #48 | ||
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My view is that most people on the right will follow anyone who provides strong leadership, be it WN, conservative or libertarian. You get a charismatic yet principled military veteran, surrounded by men willing to kill and die, everyone from the Fox fans to the VNN posters would follow him. That's my belief. |
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May 4th, 2012 | #49 | |
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May 4th, 2012 | #50 |
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I'm not talking about changing the freedom sites. I mean getting libertarians to look at VNN.
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May 4th, 2012 | #51 | |
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May 4th, 2012 | #52 | |
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While they ignore us, we can enjoy their insights about discrete freedoms, and their proofs of private-solution superiority to state coercion, even as we get the free entertainment of watching them try to explain Detroit, Karen D's town, without regard to race. Essentially libertarians aren't political, as odd as that sounds. They've dogmatically written themselves out of the equation by forswearing the use of force. Very much like the way the catholics bound themselves from effective jew opposition through their dogmatic sicut judaeis non policy. Thus must jews and libertarians ever be buffeted by the tide but never propagate it. Last edited by Alex Linder; June 19th, 2012 at 02:21 PM. |
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May 4th, 2012 | #53 | |
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May 4th, 2012 | #54 | |
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Always the words to watch for are: fetish, obsession, religious devotion, personality cult, worship. |
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May 4th, 2012 | #56 |
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The religion thread(s) have dropped off into literal madness:
blue rose May 4, 2012 - 7:37 am | Permalink @Pat Hannagan: Drop dead you f*cking cunt, and go to hell. You and yours should die a miserable death. (An old Jewish curse) Pat Hannagan May 4, 2012 - 7:14 am | Permalink Blue Rose, you’ve been talking a whole lot of shat for two days and won’t stfu, so how about you take a change and do? Got your head buried in some books have you, gonna solve our problems with your theological bent of divine White Nationalist absolution are you? How about you take your ignorant Yank flakery to the nearest Leftard dumphole and sink it there hey, how about you do that you STD infested foul feminist atheist scatologous skank c*nt. In the meantime the rest of us will get on with discussing the best way to defend our own, and take the offense forward. No one cares to be lectured by some c%ck carousel Yank with neither soul nor heart, we will never be liberated by the likes of you nor your low life Mexican fetishists, nor your high brow Yank receivers of swollen goods. Take it elsewhere, wh*re. http://www.theoccidentalobserver.net...#comment-72439 Last edited by Rick Ronsavelle; May 4th, 2012 at 04:03 PM. |
May 4th, 2012 | #58 |
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[Consider this story from Greece in light of the analysis above. I will bold relevant parts and make additional comments at bottom.]
Fascism rises from the depths of Greece's despair A neo-Nazi party that wants work camps for immigrants is on course to win its first seats in parliament on Sunday Daniel Howden It started, as many days do in Greece, with a trip to the kiosk to buy cigarettes. Still half-asleep, Panayiotis Roumeliotis was surprised to be asked to show his identity card by two young men with shaved heads. It was his first direct contact with the vigilante groups that have become a feature of everyday life in some areas of the Greek capital. "They were calling themselves the residents association but they were just fasistakia (little fascists)," said the 28-year-old. Over the last two years, Mr Roumeliotis has watched the central Athens neighbourhood of Ayios Panteleimonas, where he grew up, undergo an ugly transformation. Taking the bus on another morning soon after, a gunshot shattered the back window and a gang of men forced the driver to stop. When the doors opened, they came on to the bus and started to assault the non-Greek passengers. The attackers were wearing T-shirts from the right-wing extremist group Golden Dawn. While panicked people were trying to escape from the bus the men were hitting them with flagpoles. "They were beating people with the Greek flag," said Mr Roumeliotis. When the police arrived they stood off until the thugs had finished. When he asked the police why no one had been arrested one of the officers replied to him: "Why, did they do something to you?" Formerly a solid middle-class neighbourhood, the economic crisis and waves of new arrivals have changed the area and erased old certainties. Property prices here have dropped to as little as one quarter of what they were five years ago. The Greeks who could afford to have left. For rent signs are plastered over almost every one of the area's shabby five-storey apartment blocks. On the side streets among the North African-run mini markets and Nigerian internet cafes, newcomers from West Africa push shopping trolleys full of scrap metal stripped from deserted buildings. Large-scale drug dealing has overtaken an entire street in the neighbourhood. Violent crime has rocketed. The square in front of the local church, daubed in anti-immigrant slogans such as "foreigners don't fit in our square", has witnessed pitch battles between anarchists and Golden Dawn supporters. Among the Greeks who remain, Mr Roumeliotis' own circumstances are fairly typical. He was made redundant from the "job for life" that his grandfather had got for him at the state-run airline Olympic Airways. Of his 10 closest friends, eight are unemployed. Anger against the socialists and the conservatives, who have swapped power since the end of the dictatorship in 1974, has been building to unprecedented proportions. The former airline steward said he would not be supporting the fascists himself, but that other family members may well be doing so. "People here have been forgotten by the government," said Mr Roumeliotis. "They have done nothing about immigration." The skinheads are now talked of as "good boys" who are looking out for their community. What was happening in Ayios Panteleimonas – which has the highest concentration of immigrants in Athens – came to the attention of the rest of Greece when members of Golden Dawn were voted on to its local council. Until recently, developments in the neighbourhood were seen as dangerous but largely irrelevant to the national scene. At Greece's last general election in 2009 Golden Dawn, whose members use the Nazi salute and whose party symbol is an adapted swastika, polled fewer than 20,000 votes nationwide. Now as the country goes to the polls on Sunday, national politics more closely resemble those of the embattled area. Entering its fourth year in recession, Greece now outstrips even Spain for youth unemployment with the new statistics published yesterday showing joblessness among the under-25s at 51.2 per cent. The headline unemployment rate is 21.7 per cent while the real rate is believed to be closer to 25 per cent. It's in this environment that a fringe group of neo-Nazis that would previously have struggled to attract a hundred supporters to one of its rallies seems set to enter parliament according to polls. Together with two other ultra-nationalist parties, LAOS and Independent Greeks, some surveys indicate that the far right could take as much as one-fifth of the vote on Sunday. Under Greek law no surveys of voter intentions can be published in the fortnight before the election but unpublished polls conducted by the major political parties have been giving Golden Dawn a steady five per cent, with one poll predicting eight per cent. The threshold for entering the 300-seat parliament is three per cent and under Greece's convoluted electoral laws that could give them somewhere between eight to 12 MPs. One of the new lawmakers is likely to be Elias Panayiotaros. A candidate for central Athens, he runs a shop called Phalanx selling military gear. His business card features a Byzantine eagle and a skull and crossbones. Speaking at the party's offices opposite the Larrisis train station where volunteers do weekly handouts of clothes and food to "needy Greeks", Mr Panayiotaros said that the priority in the midst of the economic crisis was to throw out foreigners. "All of the immigrants are illegal, even the ones that have been in the country for a long time and they have to be punished," he said. Greeks were afraid to leave their homes as immigrants were on a spree of robberies, rapes and murder, he said. The cost of jailing or deporting more than a million people would be offset, he said, by putting them into work camps. Those that were not prepared to work would not be given food, he added. Another priority would be the immediate closure of all foreign non-governmental organisations, which would be compelled to return all funds to the Greek state. A new organisation would be established, he said, to be called "doctors with borders" which would provide medical services exclusively to Greeks. Once Greece was withdrawn from the EU's passport-free Schengen zone and the borders were sealed, all foreigners would require a visa to visit Greece, including the millions of tourists who come each year. "We're not afraid to be called Nazis or fascists – the whole political system is against us," said Mr Panayiotaros. Appeals by mainstream parties for Golden Dawn to be prevented from entering parliament were met with veiled threats against MPs. Asked about the party leader Nikos Michaloliakos' links to the military junta which ruled Greece between 1967-1974, he said that people were calling for the return of George Papadopoulos, the leader of the Colonel's regime. "The name of Papadopoulos is being heard everywhere," he said. Ahead of its most uncertain election, the Golden Dawn's message is getting through to some first-time voters such as Ioanna Vassila, who is unemployed. Attending a political rally for the first time in her life, the 29-year-old said she was excited to be voting for a patriotic party and that it was time to for Greece to be "cleansed of the foreigners". Laughing and joking with her boyfriend they applauded as men in paramilitary uniforms waved black flags and chanted "Greece for the Greeks". http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...r-7712276.html [Editorializing: it's an "ugly transformation," yet they're just "new arrivals," not "unwanted illegal invaders from Africa." The party (Golden Dawn) uses Nazi salute, uses swastika, provides charity help to real Greeks, calls for all invaders to be sent home, calls for international NGO troublemakers to be sent packing too. Doesn't care what people think, and is on the verge of being elected, because it alone physically defends real Greeks in the streets, and serves their needs, and will represent them politically, all while and because the government is on the side of the internationalists and the invaders."] [We saw above the theory, espoused by multiple commenters that the 'gammadion' is a no-go yet in the real-world evidence supports the opposite of view. Our cause isn't about making khaki-wearing middle-classers feel safe and good about themselves, it's about the most basic sort of physical protection and interests-representation - existence as a distinct race and people.] |
May 4th, 2012 | #59 |
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[Ex-BNP donkey nevertheless makes some points that functional conservatives who think they are WN because they hold WN positions do not understand: emotion is where the thing you're looking for lies. You have to get in their blood. That begins by making them understand that you believe your own bullshit. Bold is Barnes.]
Posted by Lee John Barnes on April 28, 2012, 12:06 PM | # Mr. Barnes as ever the charmer I see. You want ‘charm’ then hire a dvd of Brideshead Revisited. Frankly I am sick of the pseuds and their endless tedious pseudo-intellectual onanism. What are your practical tips and suggestions? You’re a longstanding activist so you must have some ideas beyond neo-Nazi raves for the kids? I have given tips and suggestions on this site for years, re-read them all. As for the neo-nazi raves for kids, as long as those kids are not liberals I am happy for them to listen to what they want. I am not a precious pseud who think nationalism should be akin to an old ladies tea party filled with tedious wafflers trying to point score against each other on the ‘I Am The Biggest Pseudo-Intellectual Wanker Scale’. For my part I have suggested the cardinal importance of considering the needs of one’s audience as the first rule of all political rhetoric (try to understand why they presently think as they do beyond the duped/moron cliché) - the needs of the speaker to ‘let off steam’ etc., are totally irrelevant. Secondly, the need to establish some tiny slice of common ground (it can be banal or trivial) as a ‘bridging mechanism’ to expand the scope of topics under discussion. Thirdly, the need to prevent the audience from ignoring what you have to say because of how you say it - basically do everything to avoid unnecessarily provoking negative associations - in terms of tone, language used, dress, mannerism etc., there is obviously far more to communication than merely the informational content of one’s message. All common sense I would have thought. 1) Your fist point is partly correct - one must seek to empathise with ones audience. But an audience is itself an aggregate of individuals - and what matters most to them, and which communicates to them most powerfully, are integrity and passion. If you dont believe what you are saying, dont say it. 2) An audience doesnt want to be lectured - they primarily want to be entertained. This is why there is a fundamental difference between an ORATOR and a COMMUNICATOR. An orator gives lecture and disseminates ideas, a communicator creates nationalists out of an audience of non-nationalists. We need communicators, not orators. Orators appeal to the converted, Communicators create the converted. 3) The primary way to inspire an audience is to appeal to their emotions and give them hope - that way you bypass the conditioning process. It isnt about intellectualism and lectures on Plato and Neitzsche to nationalists, it is about turning an suspicious audience into a converted crowd. Again somewhat obviously it’s horses for courses - a rough and ready pub is not the same as a middle-class dinner party. And the New Criterion or City Journal comment pages are not the same as those of The Sun. The communicator speaks to all of them and converts them all - they speak to their hearts and souls, hence they speak to them all at the same time. Someone else said: I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again: until this movement can shed its crazies/liars/moles/general dysfunctionals, we’re not getting anywhere, or at least not as far as we could. There are very, very few places on the internet where quality discussions of our people’s future can really take place. To have them disrupted and cluttered with increasingly outlandish liars, slanderers, and nutcases is not doing anyone any good…including the nuts. I agree - what have I been saying about self-styled dangerous/marginal antinomians for a very long time? “antinomians” In just one word you have defined exactly where the movement has gone wrong, and vanished up its own asshole. http://majorityrights.com/weblog/com...message_boards |
May 5th, 2012 | #60 |
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I left MR some time ago. By coincidence I saw the part about antinomians.
I have never been moved negatively like I have at MR. I sensed a willful refusal to understand real economics. My rage got worse and worse, without abatement. I was up at 4AM to get water and my first thought was homicide. No other site has produced any lasting reaction like that. I left. I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again: until this movement can shed its crazies/liars/moles/general dysfunctionals, we’re not getting anywhere, or at least not as far as we could. There are very, very few places on the internet where quality discussions of our people’s future can really take place. To have them disrupted and cluttered with increasingly outlandish liars, slanderers, and nutcases is not doing anyone any good…including the nuts. (from MR) |
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